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Post by rob on Jan 9, 2009 9:44:50 GMT -5
We seem to be entering a period of unprecedented secularism, a shift perhaps explained by the following:
- Intercultural marriage
- Immigration
- Rising levels of education
- Rising incomes
- Negative perceptions of faith (e.g., via priest convictions or islamic terrorist bombing)
- Secular/liberal biased media
- etc etc
Religion has become marginalized, arguably demonized in much of the western world and the concept of religious faith has eroded from shared, traditional interpretations into loose, personal ones.
It begs the questions:
1. Are you a person of faith?
2. What kind of faith and in what degree?
3. Is religious faith important to you in a relationship?
My sense is that being of mixed ethnic (and even religious) descent..... eurasians are a leading indicator of societal mores. The collective view of people on this site could be that of western (or at least internet-accessible) society in 5-10 years..... so I'm curious to know what people here believe and what that means for our future.
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 9:56:16 GMT -5
Most of the global religion themselves in my opinion is rightfully demonized as it has demonized anything not of their own since ancient times, but the SPIRITUALITY deep inside EVERY religion or any moral code should never be demonized.
1) Yes, I am a person of every faith, from Atheism to Christian to Shamanism to Islam. I appreciate wisdom when it's in front of me. Wisdom kept me alive during my youth, it kept me alive to this day. Hence, I don't have a bias towards any certain religion, but I have a bias against ethnocide and religious intolerance.
2) I believe that there is truth in every denomination of spirituality that each individual seeks through their own means. Thus, all faiths. But, I'm not fanatically supportive of any. Though yes, I am very dedicated to protecting the spirituality of politically endangered faiths in the case of 'degree'.
3) I believe spirituality is something that people have to decide for themselves. It may cause some problems but I seek to overcome them somehow. I'm encountering my own problems in present times. =/
But, somehow, I'll pull through...
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 10:06:51 GMT -5
No, in truth of what I've seen, he is right. In Australia people despise religion, and many believe it causes all wars. Australian people are peaceful at heart, so they are very sensitive to religion itself. There are Muslim and Buddhist and Christian communities sure, but the majority of Australians are agnostic. I was born and raised here, I know.
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Post by swinger on Jan 9, 2009 10:16:18 GMT -5
You spend too much time on the internet. Religion isn't demonized. Except by 20 somethings who post on message boards. The majority of people are still religious. Some nice, some extreme.. But the majority does apparently swing that way. People wouldn't come on to internet to piss and moan about it so much if they didn't encounter it in real life somehow. Wait...Rob spends too much time on the Internet? Hah, that's a good one! A USA Today/Gallup Poll in 2002-JAN showed that almost half of American adults appear to be alienated from organized religion. If current trends continue, most adults will not call themselves religious within a few years.www.religioustolerance.org/chr_prac2.htmThe trend is toward "Spiritual but not religious". The practice of 'faith' is changing away from organized religion. Good info at religions.pewforum.org/ |
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 10:21:08 GMT -5
You can't be serious, though I don't live in the states, and my opinion is pfft...
... I'm under the impression that the states is also agnostic, in which swinger has already mentioned with facts. Are you implying that the American government is far from secular? o.O
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Post by swinger on Jan 9, 2009 10:23:04 GMT -5
An Atheist, or even a moderate believer, couldn't win even a Junior Senate position here in the States. Even the ones may be atheists will pay lip service, because it's damning to their entire platform. That tells me about the majority here. It tells you about labels, perception, but nothing about actual faith and practice. The middle class people from America's breadbasket who voted Republican because they were sure the Republicans had their best economic interests at heart did so while they were being screwed over by those same people. Politics is image, advertising, perception and even tribalism. Politicians also pretend to be loyal to their spouses, straight, non-users of drugs, etc. People know better, see evidence to the contrary all the time, yet still demand the squeaky 'image' and platform. Acutally, that's how many treat their faith in this country: all lip service. How many times have you seen parents and friends of a murderous thug who finally met his doom say "Oh, he's in a better place now..." The concept of judgment and hell has been replaced with heaven for everyone - even the non-believers. You can wear a big blinged-out cross everywhere and point to the heavens when you score a touchdown - that doesn't make you religious, however. |
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 10:28:22 GMT -5
^ Agreed, there's no existent label for me or most people who find their own individual spiritual path. We accept labels to simplify things but it never represents our true beliefs.
I am, Tengriist, but I don't go around summoning ancestral spirits or making shrines, etc.
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 10:38:09 GMT -5
Well if I was a leader of a nation I will also enforce religious tolerance, it is my morality after all and my culture. Even if I say "Mongol Christians, Mongol Muslims, Mongol Tengriist", live in harmony with each other, doesn't mean that the entire Mongol population is one of those three groups. In truth, most are also agnostic.
Thats what me, a Tengriist, and her, a Christian minister, seek in this world.
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 10:45:55 GMT -5
Heh American politics, I'm afraid I'm not too educated in such. However, I do believe that rob is implying this topic on the general population, not the leaders themselves.
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 10:51:18 GMT -5
Well, from my humble and limited knowledge - so yes, call me stupid about American politics because I sure am heh... Hillary Clinton did mention a previous comment in regards to labelling whites 'hard-working citizens' and blacks as not. So it is apparent that Obama does elect rather... 'interesting people', perhaps he sees his own 'use' of them? Or perhaps, he sees electing people that don't represent his views as a political move to show that he is nonetheless, a man who 'doesn't take s*** personally?'
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 12:44:48 GMT -5
^ Well in my opinion you have to find someone who share similar beliefs as you. Not saying that they have to have exactly the same beliefs as you as that would be... boring  But enough similarities and interests to bring you two together, and not cause friction. One may ask, what brought a Pagan and a Christian together. Heh, we both are individuals. Nonetheless, we have learnt, are learning, and look forward to learn more from each other in the future. I'm p****whooped I know  |
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 12:55:41 GMT -5
^ LOL oh hell it wasn't too long ago I was saying "NO WAY IS MY KID GOING TO HAVE HIS OR HER FACE PLUNGED IN WATER IN BAPTISM"... but now... I'm so stressed out so anything may go lol!
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Post by penguinopolipitese on Jan 9, 2009 13:53:26 GMT -5
It begs the questions:
1. Are you a person of faith?
2. What kind of faith and in what degree?
3. Is religious faith important to you in a relationship? I was born a snake handler and I'll die a snake handler.  |
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Post by Subuatai on Jan 9, 2009 13:55:12 GMT -5
... ouch =/
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Post by buff on Jan 9, 2009 22:49:43 GMT -5
This is like a politics thread.  Anyway yes, faith is important to me. I don't care if the guy is atheist or agnostic but a cradle Catholic, maybe cradle Episcopalian or Lutheran would do. For me it's lovely to share stories of Catholic school, confession, first communion, past Christmas and Easter, be with someone who knows about this stuff. It's a cultural thing. It 's like I'm more comfortable with American and Canadian guys. I have been with foreign ones but they came when they were 12 maybe 20 at the most and are so assimilated and understand the nuances and body language of North Americans. For example I've met cool Indian guys who speak perfect English but I don't get them. They can say things that I just didn't understand even though I knew all the words in the sentence. Also a lot of Indian guys I meet are Muslim or Hindu so I just don't feel a connection at ALL even though many are cute. Faith isn't everything but it is important to me. I agree with you regarding the degree of importance. When you’re young and looking it’s easy for you to say religion doesn’t matter. But when you start raising kids, the problem pops out. I’m speaking based on what I observed from a couple of friends and compared their relationships. The most problematic one is from an EA friend who is catholic and married a secular guy from a jewish-catholic background. His parents raised him secular. It’s like they’re living separate lives under one roof. She went to a Catholic school and has been practicing the traditions, he doesn’t. She had to beg him to baptize the child minus his parents who also ditched the church wedding. |
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