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Post by ribena on Jun 18, 2006 3:56:20 GMT -5
"how many people really understand what good Japanese food is?" that is the point , making them understand ! "It's supply / demand - people want to eat that stuff." They don't even KNOW that there are other things ^^ Nao - I understand your point of view, but in real life that just doesn't happen. A regular joe, to whom Japanese food is considered fast food, will go to a Japanese fast food chain - say Yoshinoya - and expect a cheap gyudon. He is not going to go up to the counter and ask "oh wait - are there better Japanese food out there?!". Nor is he going to appreciate it if the cooking staff whips up something completely different omakase style for him to try. He just wants a gyudon. People will go to places that serve food they'd want to eat. |
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nao
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Post by nao on Jun 18, 2006 4:59:44 GMT -5
ever stop to think that the reason dishes get corrupted / adapted in the first place is because in their original form, they simply do not suit the palate of other countries? You can't make people understand if they do not want to understand. Many foreigners have trouble with Japanese food when they come here and I know that what I now consider to be good Japanese food is not the kind of thing any of my friends back home could eat comfortably, or would choose to eat in a city like London or Paris. I never forget about the difference regarding the taste between cultures, as myself do find some flavours "unsuitable" to my own palate... this so obvious that i discarded it , but as you bring that up i concur. Of course i can not make people understand if they don't want to , but at least i can try, for my friends for instance , if they like it ,great , we can enjoy it together , if not ...well i won't stop seeing them because of that . Like i said , it is all about sharing things, experiencing. As you said many foreigners have issues with Japanese food but some( most ? ) of them gets along with it pretty fine afterward. You sure did discover dishes you didn't know before as you said. And how is that the fault of the restaurant? The onus is not on the restaurant to provide an education on what is good and what is bad, the restaurant is in the business to sell a service that people want. If people want to find out that there are alternatives to what they currently eat, they will - they can hit the internet, buy a magazine, ask a Japanese friend, go to another part of town. People have free will - you aren't being forced into these bad restaurants and if you are stupid enough to think that they are your ONLY option, then that's your fault, not the restaurant's. Not a "fault", again never said that, but rather discarding other possiblities in purpose, for several reasons ( valid or not ) , and then by doing so , narrowing choices for the custormer. You said that it has to provide a service, period . Define service ? The educational part is a wonderfull asset ! Exemple : go to a good french restaurant , and say that we order meal , do you happen to know EVERY single dishes on the menu ? ever ? you have to stop what you do for a living and become a walking encyclodepia. Never asked a "sommelier" which wine would be better for some type meal ( and i am not speaking about basic stuff : red wine , red meat / white , fishes ... ) ? don't tell me that you also are the recipient of the knowledge in oenolgy too? It is okay to ask, it is ok not to know, you can ask for a...service. Some people when they go out , don't plan all in advance , they just want to go out , chilling , have a good meal , they are not going for an adventure in some unknown country, with a guide , a native or whatever. Of course I am speaking for a casual evening meal out , not a fast food/express lunch suitable when you don't have time to eat . People have free will but are "forced" in a way because of the limited number of good places to go are far more outnumbered by the bad ones. This is not stupid thinking this is just logic and maths. I don't see your point here, other than that Japan has copied a lot of its staple foods from other countries. Tempura, miso, sushi were all being consumed in other countries long before Japan adopted them and "made them Japanese". My point was about "cultural re-interpretation of food" as you mentionned in your previous post , not to stress that i find it amazing that Tempura was according to you consumed in other countries long before in asia even if it is specific to portuguese missionaries in japan. Or as to state that sushi was of course invented by the first anthropoïd in africa when they ate raw fishes... Japan copies everything , this is so "cliché" ( ok i admit their are pretty good at it  ) A horrible example. How exactly can you f**k up a deep-fried dish? It's like the baked beans on toast of Japan. I hate those tonkatsu senmon ten with a passion - why would I pay through the nose to eat something that is no better for me than a McDonald's meal? Japan has abused the deep fried cutlet for too long - I don't even look on that food as being Japanese anymore. To me, Japanese food is seasonal, fresh, healthy, minimum prep and beautiful. f**k all that deep fried stuff. But that's my opinion - I don't care if you think deep fried stuff is the very definition of washoku - it's not my place to educate you, and it's not the restaurant's place to educate you; you eat what you bloody well like. Again this is your choice , and I respect that , who am i to say that billions of japanese liked those fried dishes, and those are in japan cookery for ages like nabe... I really liked that last part , of course it is not your place nor your role , to educate me in anyway about anything. I, so far, handled myself pretty good, and be assure that i do eat what i like and didn't wait for your approval  This place is about giving opinions , i get yours, as well as all the others , you know mine. Isn't it great? Anyhow , going back to the topic : i don't care at all to have a cook , waitress ... from a different ethnia/background as long as the food is good. |
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Post by rob on Jun 19, 2006 1:00:33 GMT -5
"how many people really understand what good Japanese food is?" that is the point , making them understand ! "It's supply / demand - people want to eat that stuff." They don't even KNOW that there are other things ^^ Nao - I understand your point of view, but in real life that just doesn't happen. A regular joe, to whom Japanese food is considered fast food, will go to a Japanese fast food chain - say Yoshinoya - and expect a cheap gyudon. He is not going to go up to the counter and ask "oh wait - are there better Japanese food out there?!". Nor is he going to appreciate it if the cooking staff whips up something completely different omakase style for him to try. He just wants a gyudon. People will go to places that serve food they'd want to eat. i always have the same conversation with my friends [Friend]: I'm in love [Me]:No you're not in love [Friend]: Who are you to tell me that I'm not in love? I'm the one in love!!! [Me]: I know what love is and that ain't love. [Friend]: How the f*ck would you know and not me? Do you know something I don't mr know it all? I'm the one feeling it, not you. [Me]: Yes, and that emotion you're feeling is a cheap chinese rip-off. [Friend] Call it what you want, that's just how I feel and I'm the one that feels it. [ Me ]: My point is that you can do better, you can love alot more than that. [Friend]: No, I can't. The world doesn't operate according to your definition of it rob. This is what I feel and I'm not asking you to tell me what I feel. I just want you to be happy for me [me] I'm sorry. I love you but I'm not happy for you. [friend] *sigh* The point being is that you can never tell people what's right or what's good for them. But nonetheless, you should keep trying until you have no friends left. |
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nao
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Post by nao on Jun 19, 2006 5:10:19 GMT -5
errr ... are we still talking about food here ?
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Post by david on Jun 19, 2006 6:44:18 GMT -5
People will go to places that serve food they'd want to eat. I guess kind of like people will go to Forums that serve crap they’d want to read and post (Not saying you post crap but you get my drift ) |
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Post by miaim on Jun 23, 2006 5:10:20 GMT -5
Off topic, but since we are now getting onto that dead horse topic of "Chinese people shouldn't run Japanese restaurants", I have to say, business is business. i totally agree - it doesn't bother me that the Chinese pretend to be japs & run jap restaurants....i'll even connive & refrain from telling anybody unless they ask that they are not japs but Chinese pretending to be japs.....& since i can tell the fake ones from the real ones, i'm not fooled by the fakes....so i don't really care: if anything i find it quite amusing - all power to the Chinese!....it's just that i, being half jap & having grown up there, don't want to eat at most of the Chinese run jap restaurants....just like italians abroad don't want to eat at an Italian joint run by non-Italians.... anyway, the jap restaurant in paris i go most often to is owned & run by Chinese - except they've actually lived in Japan..... i'd rather the cuisine is prepared by someone of that culture & that the restaurant is frequented by people of that culture (i'd rather eat Viet or Thai food prepared by Viets or Thais than japs if i'm in japan too) ....how fussy i want to be about this depends on my mood tho.... that's all there was to my post - & methinks nano's.... peace |
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Post by Altan on Jun 23, 2006 23:10:48 GMT -5
Best Ethnik restaurants in Frisco:
Indian: Naan And Curry (New one off Powell) Have the Fish Tandoori..$10 for 2 nice pieces of fish. Recomend the Haleema and the Braised Lamb Curries.
Japanese: One next to the Original Nice Miyako in J-Town--Try their Futomaki that will tell you a lot because Futomaki's usually suck whever you go. It's more for the Japanese business traveler. I had a mountain apple over there and it was reaally differen't.
Korean: Brothers 1 or 2 for the Bi-Bim Bop always interesting
Chinese: Cheap eats in the Sunset and a Koi Palace in S. City which has some interesting plates, deserts, and dim-sums.
Thai: One across the Red Vic Theatre..prices not bad and really interesting stuff.
Middle East Arab/Semitic Foods: Fattosh on Church has some interesting stuff, a Moroccan place which is Hallal for those who are Muslim down in the Tenderloin, and Old Jerusalem on the Mission for an unbelievable down home Palestinian meal for cheap. We ate at Old Jerusalem for a little over $20 like a king( which means we couldn't finish.)
Recommend other stuff here Mandarin Islamic in the Sunset...northern Chinese...lot's of Lamb, known in the Chinese community for it's Hot Pot. I love lamb and Peking Lamb Pancakes, Lamb dumplings boiled, Lamb with green onions......I love Lamb/mutton. Lot's of Chili for those that love the Northern Style close to Beijing and Mongolia.
For Vietnamese I like to go to Irving. Around 19th and 20th competitive and prices good at the Pho houses.
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Post by davidbleo on Jun 25, 2006 23:06:52 GMT -5
Here there's mexican/japanese specials... sushi with avocado, and I must say that it tastes quite good ...of course the places where you find that are runned by mexicans  |
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Post by miaim on Jun 27, 2006 4:29:23 GMT -5
well, the avocado maki 's actually californian....hence the name, "California" maki....in japan itself, they tend to think it's a lil weird, tho i like it!  and kyu-ree's right: the Koreans have their own maki...not surprising as the japs & Koreans eat the same kind of sticky rice, the only one that can be compressed into 'sushi'.... i know what you mean tho, girl: i haven't been to my fave Korean restaurant in Paris since i was told it was sold to a white frenchman & a srilankan (dun ask....lol)..... irrelevant sidenote: worked in a Chinese run Jap joint in Paris when i was a student - & i had to pretend everyone else was jap, not Chinese.....surreal, really! lmao! peace |
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Post by davidbleo on Jun 27, 2006 13:46:58 GMT -5
 so it's californian... my whole life has been a lie  But the avocado is 100% mexican... the word comes from ahuacatl in nahuatl... which happens to have other meanings |
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Post by londongirl on Jun 28, 2006 9:24:18 GMT -5
Kyu-ree, pork LOL! When I want japanese food, I go to wagamam's in St. Albans. Unfortunately, I haven't had moroccan food in ages, how I love spicy hamin. ;D |
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Post by Altan on Jun 29, 2006 0:59:39 GMT -5
Califonia Roll comes from some mixture of Japan and Califonia....basically. Proably some Japanese Sushi Chef in Los Angeles created it for his Hollywood patrons back in the 70's or 80's? Not sure? Doner Kebab was proably the orginal Shwarma...not sure what Shwarma translates in Arabic or Hebrew. If it even has a meaning in Hebrew. Read in a Lonely Planet travel guide that Doner Kebab was the orginal Shwarma. Who knows.
Right now I'm craving some of the Lamb Dishes at this Mandarin Islamic restaurant here in Frisco in the Sunset. I love Lamb.
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Post by z. on Jul 10, 2006 2:52:09 GMT -5
Today i landed a job at WAGAMAMA! yay!
i'm gonna be a founding team member of their 3rd Melbourne store, opening in about 4 weeks! very exciting.
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Post by Altan on Jul 10, 2006 23:32:09 GMT -5
Wagamama went to the one down in Sydney. Pretty popular place when I went there.
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Post by Jonathan on Jul 11, 2006 15:41:44 GMT -5
Today i landed a job at WAGAMAMA! yay! i'm gonna be a founding team member of their 3rd Melbourne store, opening in about 4 weeks! very exciting. Congratulations Neil! My mum told me to work at the Wagamama that's opening soon in Newcastle but I don't think it's my kind of job  |
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so it's californian... my whole life has been a lie 
